By David Ciccone, posted Monday, Oct. 1st, 2007
Reader Comments: 125
The most robust Windows Mobile device on the market today..
More powerful than any mobile communications device you've used before, the HTC TyTN II takes global connectivity to the next level. Staying connected means staying ahead. The TyTN II supports the full spectrum of network standards, guaranteeing that you will stay in touch ANYWHERE in the world. With an internet connection via 3.5G HSDPA that is nine times faster than 3G, using the TyTN II to download files and surf the Web is a breeze.
Video Review
I have to say the first week of using the HTC TyTN II has been pretty interesting. The unit is probably one of the most powerful Windows Mobile phones I have used to date other than the HTC Advantage. I am very happy with the lack of soft resets, something that has plagued me with the WM6 Treo 750 I was using. The TyTN II does have some quirky things that really tick me off. The unit will not accept the little brother HTC TyTN battery! Yes, It is a completely different size! Now don't get me wrong but COMON HTC lets get logical. The battery is a Samsung KAS160 battery which is a measly 1350mAh battery. Totally unacceptable for a POWERHOUSE phone. So what did I do? I immediately grabbed my USB car charger that has worked on EVERY HTC device I owned.. Guess what? Nope it wouldn't work! So now I have to patiently wait for an extended battery solution. I am hoping our store will carry them also.
Now to the things I like! Boy where do I start. The TyTN II works like a charm with Skype and Slingbox! Two applications that are very processor intensive and it ran like a charm! I called Steve on the TyTN II over 3G and he clearly heard me with no feedback and a very slight delay. It almost makes you wish Skype for Windows Mobile supported video calling because this phone definitely would work with it. During my use with the Slingbox, I noticed really no problems whatsoever. The Sling always went to full screen giving me the best horizontal view possible. Now since the device slides open and at a 40 degree angle it is a pleasure to watch while eating my lunch.
One other factor that drew me into purchasing the TyTN II was the GPS radio. I have been using the free map w/TomTom and I was using Google Maps but once you get a taste of TomTom you really want the full experience. So yesterday I placed an order at the Mobility Today store for Tom Tom 6 Navigator for PocketPC! I have read many forums where people were not sure if the TomTom 6 Navigator for PocketPC would work and for confirmation it did! When I got the DVD today I immediately installed the application and was prompted with an error, "Not enough space on HTC TyTN II".. Now, I should have known since I only had a 1GB card so I once again placed an order for a Sandisk 4GB MicroSD card. Now this is the mother of all memory cards to buy for any Windows Mobile phone! I used the included reader to move all my previous content from my 1GB card to the 4GB card which it only took 4.5 minutes to move 850MB's of data!!! Unbelievable!
Once I got the maps installed I timed exactly how long it took the TyTN II to lock the satellites. The average time took me only 6.5 seconds!!! This is even better than my TomTom 910 unit! The guidance is dead on and exact! Now I have only used the TomTom for 1 day but I do have some long trips coming up so I definitely will put it through some paces...
So please keep posted as I will continue my adventure with the HTC TyTN II.. Please continue to post your questions as I will answer them as I can.
DISLIKES
The unit definitely needs a bigger battery 1350mAh just doesn't cut it especially for a device with 802.11, HSDPA, GPS and Bluetooth.
I have no clue how to tweak the GPS as there is no application associated with it? It just works..
TomTom included is a complete waste for US. Why? Because you have to buy the entire US/Canada maps on DVD not like European maps where you can buy cities.
Bluetooth pairing w/my Speakerphone worked fine but it looks like the Bluetooth Stack on the TyTN II is weird. Volume is much lower compared to the Q9m and Treo 750.
US Tech support is terrible for this unit. As per HTC America's "We will not support the TyTN II, thank you sir have a nice day!"
I need Microsoft Voice Command... CASE CLOSED! Poor decision HTC!!!!
LIKES
I LOVE the tilt screen. Most comfortable keyboard I have ever used.
Skype is fantastic on the TyTN II! Wish I could get video to work on Skype but they haven't enabled it yet..
Memory, Memory, Space.. Gotta love it!
3MP camera takes some great pictures!
TomTom teaser makes me want to spend more money for maps.. Perfect fit for me in NY when walking around Manhattan.
GPS works with zero configuration
Google Maps and Live Search for Mobile works perfectly with the embedded GPS.
Nice touch by adding a screen protector in the box
USB charging.. Gotta love it!
Slingbox works perfectly.. No stuttering and full screen viewing is beautiful on the tilt
After over one year of use I just wanted to write few lines about my impression of this PDA.
I travel a lot and I thought that a PDA could be helpful to keep in touch and do the IT chores while on the go. I was very wrong and I regret having bought the damn thing. The device tries to do many things but none of them well. In retrospective it sounded too good to be true.
At the beginning I did make a point of using it to its best potential but after a while I got so tired and annoyed with it that I have recently used it mostly like just any other phone.
I thought I would give myself some time to get accustomed to the complexity of the device before jumping to conclusions.
Over one year later and I still find it cumbersome and totally user unfriendly. The guys at HTC should go to Apple to get a crush course in making something user friendly and intuitive.
Here are just a few things. The list is way longer but I would have to go back and try most functions to recall all the flaws.
- It's super slow. I am no super fast teenage geek but I am always waiting for the stupid thing to react to any command I give. It is very annoying and it's like stepping back to the time of the 286 PCs. The speed is archaic. For example it takes 4.5 sec to switch from the vertical screen to the horizontal and back.
- The buttons controls are very difficult to feel with the touch and are very cumbersome to operate. Especially the side ones. I am sure that even blind people would have problems using them.
- Windows mobile is as bad as Microsoft gets. It's slow, counter intuitive, user unfriendly. Early Vista at the power of ten!
- Window media player is a joke. I have been using the PDA to listen to music in the car and it's a miracle I have not crashed while trying to select some music yet. To get to the card MP3 files it takes a very contorted and long way.
- The touch screen is also very bad and difficult to use. A lot of the commands are way too small for a man's finger while using one hand. It is very difficult to select something on first attempt with your thumb.
- To open a running program is difficult. One has to press the top right menu and than select what is running by touch only. The bar is about 4 mm high and it's very difficult to select using one hand. One cannot select by using the scroll bar and button.
- During phone calls the screen goes out quickly and to get it back one has to look for the hidden button on the side, very, very bad.
- Voice recognition sucks. Since the controls are so bad I now use the voice recognition most times. It's rare that the damn machine get it right on first attempt. Repeating the name twice helps but not always. I end up having to raise the tone as if I was yelling. It is very embarrassing in public.
- The GPS takes a long time to get the satellites even when the data has been updated.
- Active sync is a disaster. The guy who design it should be shot. I have given up on it altogether. I had to buy small software to access the data in the PDA and memory card.
Active sync could just not do the most elementary operation in a simple and straightforward way. You simply cannot plug into a computer and access the PDA like a USB stick. You have to buy a program for that. Isn’t that a joke?
- The booting upon starting is the longest I have ever seen. Switching it off is also a chore. I just live it always on.
- The battery capacity is way too small. Some applications will run down the battery in no time.
The list goes on but I am getting annoyed just to think about it all. This is the first and last product I’ll ever buy from HTC. Unless you are a geek that gets pleasure messing with IT devices do not buy it. Its use will take an unhealthy amount of your time. It will not help your life, it will waste a lot of your time and annoy you in the process.
In the first few months I tried to fix it and make it work to an acceptable level by downloading ROMs that improved the performance and install a program that would let me access the card via USB. Then I had problems and had to remove the ROMs. I then gave up on it. I keep it to use the navigator which is guess what? neither HTC or MS.
If you want something that works decently well out of the box don’t buy this one!
Posted by
,
Wednesday, Jun. 17th, 2009
I currently have a Sprint Instinct. Can this phone be configured to my Sprint account?
I have a tytn 2 and im trying to watch videos on youtube, but I keep getting windows media error that says an unknown error 0x8007274d has occurred, can anybody help me?
doesnt the grip on the slide keyboard wear off at all
Posted by
,
Saturday, Jun. 21st, 2008
some knows if the HTC TyTn 2 can work with Blackberry connect or not? and also pin to pin between the HTC TYTn2 and blackberrys cell
Please advise
Posted by
,
Friday, Apr. 25th, 2008
Hi, my LCD cracked by placing it on carpet. Support stated it won't be warranteed, that the LCD cracked from behind. I escallated the issue and HTC won't budge, same song and dance. I litterally didn't do anything but put my phone on the floor, pick it up a moment later, tried to use it and found the LCD busted/all scrambled. This is the 2nd LCD from HTC that has cracked on me - each time they blame me instead of recalling the phone due to lack of stability, manufacturer defect, etc. I highly recommend that anyone considering an HTC phone seriously consider other vendors based on support and warrantee. The $800 phone has cost me over $1K...
HTC bites!
Posted by
,
Wednesday, Apr. 9th, 2008
hi, saw your Youtube demo , which is really great, thanks, I bought one TYTnII , i have a question on SKYPE version installed by you, pls send me a link, the new version on the skype web site is not accepted by the HTC TYTNII mobile i bought. thanks for your help reg this.
Posted by
,
Monday, Mar. 24th, 2008
hey dave how are u? Question is the TyTn II available in the U.s. and if it's not when will it hit the sprint stores or any retail stores for that matter?
I just got my Tilt, unlocked it, and removed the ATT bloatware on it. Overall I am very happy with it. The only thing I noticed is sometimes it will freeze while I am tapping the screen or using the keys, but it's intermittent, and it only freezes for a second and continues on. I use it on TMobile, and seems to work great despite being stuck on Edge.
I have had the Tilt for two weeks. Am trying to decide if it is going back. The battery life is very poor, especially if the Bluetooth option is on. It takes time to sync the Bluetooth headset each time I get a phone call, especially if I have to turn on the Bluetooth function. I wanted a PDA, incidentally a phone, because I want to read my books on the device, along with play music, and give up my old HP PDA. I am thinking about a Moto Q instead. Does anyone have any suggestions for these two problems.
May I know the HTC TyTn 2 can work with Blackberry connect or not? thx
Posted by
,
Tuesday, Feb. 19th, 2008
I like the idea with the phone, but is somewhat disapointed with the performance. Compared with my IPAQ 3660, there isn't much new under the performance hood.
Scrolling webpages is slow and scrolls in big chunks, using as a phone is somewhat hard, since the buttons goes black once you dialed the number.
Works like a charm for calendar and messageing.. unless you have to scroll the email with pictuers.
The camera is very slow on focus and taking a picture, but when it takes the image is OK.
this phone is freakin awsome got it for my wife for $149 at att during a specail and i didnt buy my self but i really messed up i cant find one under 450 now u can do so much customizing on this phone the american att version blue sceen kinda suck so i did some reserch and found a diffrent screen that is the one that htc put on it,(like the one on the video) u can even get the htc album and zoom in , zoom out,flip change the pic all with the touch of a finger! just like the iphone! and if you got this phone u got to get kaiser tweaks it let u manage the touch with touch flo. its an iphone like movement im gonna start customizing them were i live cauce u can do lot with this phone, my nephew has the iphone but he wants to trade for this one, u can even get a fully funtion iphone screen exactly like the iphone and i mean exactly if any ones intrested in were to get them the stuff is all free i just dont know if theyll let me put them on this site ill check back soon!! buy this phone!!
Posted by
,
Monday, Jan. 7th, 2008
Please someone tell me what means flash memory in windows language. Im asking because of the 8gb the Iphone has. I dont know how much memory the HTC TYTN II has comparing to the Iphone´s 8gb. Thanks,
Just do not belief it - there are tons of offers to buy for less than $ 300.00 the TyTn II.Iam very critical on it, has some one checked it out? Would change esay fromthe Ipaq 6915 to the TyTn II
Don't buy it-I hate my new TyTN2.
I had a Treo 650 and boy do I miss it. The Treo just works (with PalmOS)even with lack of memory and processor speed. I know Palm isn't going anywhere at the moment but I could at least play my songs. The Audio manager on TyTN2 can't see any music files. I also hate WM6-compared to Palm it's counter intuitive. If you're contemplating moving from Palm-don't, you'll miss the keypad that always in front of you. If you liked Agendus on your palm and decided to get it for your Tytn, you'll end up necking yourself. It runs like a dog-sooo slllooowww.I'm researching software so I can start using the phone properly.And why did they put the power button on the side? When you try to find it your finger ends up sliding the phone slightly-annoying.Maybe I'm in the early stages of learning what it can do, or just having a bad 3 days, and particularly if you're a Mac user. Maybe it's just hard to get any info and solutions, but I'd be happy if they took the phone back and I purchased the latest Treo. God I hope this gets better! And why is the damn phone flashing its screen on occasionally when it should be off? Piece of crap
Well Dave I took the plunge and put my tilt on eBay today I’m left with my iPhone and BB 8820 now this is the first time since 1999 Casio E-100 that I don’t carry a WM device I don’t know if you remember that unit? But I will not have a windows mobile phone. Thought you were insane with your windows mobile boycott but decided as long as we buy the phones there will be no need to take our feedback into consideration so I will be behind the boycott. Thanks
If I buy the TyTN II from an European source, can I use it for AT&T Wireless here in the US? I suppose it is just any Tilt on steroid, right? Thanks in advance.
Hi,
I have a problem getting connected to internet via Wi Fi. the first day I used the device I was able to get connected but since then I am unable to do so regardless of which network I choose.
I do see the available networks on the screen but the device does not get connected. It seems to be going from network to network and keeps trying to connect to the.
Can anyone please help me out.
Thank you.
Posted by
,
Sunday, Nov. 25th, 2007
After 2 weeks the screen on my TYTNII cracked while carrying it in a loose pocket without any noticeable trauma. Protector was on. Didn't sit on it/drop it etc. Seems others have had this problem. HTC say not their problem but screen seems to be very fragile. Any thoughts/advice.
I have had the Orange TyTnII for two whole days and have barely scratched the surface of its excellent multi-functional capabilities. However, there appears to be a major flaw which occurs whilst making a phone call. After a very short time, about 30secs, the screen goes completely black and will not turn on again without hitting the ON/OFF button. This is very annoying if you are inserting responses to an automated answering system. Firstly, the period before which it goes into sleep mode needs to be user-adjustable and secondly, a tap on the screen should restore the picture. Is this problem likely to be rectified by HTC?
Almost perfect device! However, I don't think I could be happy with the 2.8 inch screen. It's so much smaller than the 3.5 inch screen on my Dell Axim X30. Why does it matter? I use my Pocket PC for navigation with Co-Pilot Live 6. I would like a larger screen that I currently have, not smaller.
I'll have to wander over to the AT&T store to try it in person. Maybe I should just buy that monster HTC Advantage and a purse to carry it in! :-)
hello everybody. awesome device indeed, with great options. can anyone help me with the following: when receiving a text message, we can only see the sender's number not the person's name (even if this person is on the contact list). is there a way to fix this problem?
thx to all
Does ANYONE have any suggestions on the low bluetooth volume issue? I have a jawbone and it worked GREAT with the JASJAM...volume was terrific...but when I moved over to the TyTnII, I can barely hear a thing...especially in the car. Anyway, tried support and got nowhere. Any suggestions would be great. Otherwise, a terrific device, IMHO.
Dave, In your video review of the phone, you mention the "Ultimate Search Application", but I can't find any other information on this. Can you please tell us where we can download this application? Thanks so much for the review! I love my new TytnII!!
The TyTN II is a very powerful machine, but besides those muscle specs, I am impressed about the easiness to maneuver this device. The combination of the multiple buttons and the HTC home page make it a pleasure to have it in your hands. The right and left soft keys are fantastic as every screen give you the right option for your selection, delete a mail, close a program, switch a call, it just guesses your next move, it’s great! Then the HTC home screen lets you do so many things with your fingers, the stylus is hardly needed, but still available. I-phone is not the 7th marvel, this is it!, you touch for e-mails, SMS, weather, open any program , play a game, change settings, open your own downloads, music or GPS, ringer status, connectivity options, and so on… you just put your thumb and you get there. And if this is not enough, the other keys will take you to windows menu, internet explorer, camera or phone. You lean it and it gets really easy.
But if this is not enough to do your work, you still have the track-wheel if you were ever used to a blackberry (It works better for left-handed); and then the Qwerty board than springs so easily at any moment when you need to type longer stuff.
The way this device adapts to you makes a great difference and this is why TyTN II is so great and probable the best in the market today.
Secondly, I am impressed about what this is; people ask me if this is my new phone. It’s hard to respond as this is my PHONE which has voice recognition to just talk a name and get it dialed, it is also my PDA that is fully sync with outlook, it is my mini-laptop where I can review any type of document as Word, Excel, PowerPoint, Adobe, it is a WEB BROWSER that connects either you EDGE/3G cellular signal or it gets the Wi-Fi wherever available; it is your E-MAIL device to be connected at all times with pushed technology and ability to have multiple e-mails at the same time; it is a very powerful GPS with Tom-tom to get anywhere with very easy key-in directions; it is an MP3 PLAYER with as good or better sound quality to my I-pod and a CAMERA-VIDEO with 3 MP, enough to take decent pictures as you go.
Regarding it technical capabilities, I’m sure everyone has read them everywhere and it no point saying this is the top-notch as of today, however, I believe that the combination of RAM and processor speed make is a very fast device and their connectivity features are very easy to get the best wherever you are. The Micro-SD is a great thing, I have a 6 GB and works great, I have Tom-tom maps for the whole US, hundreds of songs and few videos and still allows me to save space for files and other programs.
Any lowlights? Not really, you could always want a better screen (VGA), or audio jack to connect my Bose headphones, or the track-wheel on the other side for right-handed, yes, nobody is perfect.
Posted by
,
Sunday, Nov. 4th, 2007
I know you used the 4GB micro HD card in this unit but would the 6GB or 8GB ones work as well?
Im going to buy this Smartphone tomorrow, in english version but for use in Spain. Could someone please tell me what things I should buy for it to make it more useful, like gps things and stuff, I never had tomtom before..so..I guess it would be helpful someone recomend me what to get for this phone to make it really powerfull and useful. I gonna get 2gb memory card, but if 4 gb card is also compatible and accepted then I would get the 4gb microsd. ok, here is my email: changepasscheck@hotmail.com
if someone know how to get it fully updated, with skype, may be skype with videocall? :)) i just dont understand that dvd buying for gps, I want to use the navigation for all europe, and how to install it? easy?. do i need an extra antena or something?... uff..anyway, contact by email, thanks!!!!.
Posted by
,
Thursday, Oct. 25th, 2007
Is there any way to get touch flow on the Tilt? I see that the Tytn II has it. Did ATT disable it?
If the built in audio player does not offer the option to toggle the screen on/off while playing music, you need to either get yourself a better media player (Pocket Player is a great option, especiall the latest version) or get yourself a small util that allows screen toggling (ie. PHM Power Toys). Also, you would be able to turn off the device if listening to your music thru a pair of A2DP BT headphones, which is an option you might want to consider given all the things wireless stereo headsets offer.
PocketNow seems to be a bit disenchanted with the Tytn II calling it a heavy brick of a device that slows down considerably when multitaking even with a 400mhz proccessor and gobs of ram.
Hi David, I have some issues with TyTN II. I have read the instruction and all but I cannot find any information about screensaver. As far as I know, there is no screensaver with this device. When I am listening to the music with my device, screen light never turns off which is wasting battery life (and it bugs me so much since I listen to music with my device when I commute everday). Plus this device does not allow you to change the ringer volume which is so strange and silly for mobile. Ringer volume is not in an option and only turn it off or on (eventhough there is an option called increasing ring, which does nothing almost). I am very surprised that such phone functions with this device are not supported at all. This is mobile and not a PC. Portable Pocket PC, then should have screen saver without turning the device off. If the device is turned off, then I cannot listen to the music. I think this is ridiculous. Or is there any solution?
Just bought myself HTC TyTN II which use windows OS. Been exploring the gadget but being a slow learner I find the learning curve to be quite steep. I use Apple MacOS for desktop computing. I believe it can be synchronised to work easily with the PDA phone that I have now. So can anybody out there suggest anything ... TQ
I have a question about the HTC TyTN II. I find out that there are 2 kinds of HTC TyTN II. I don't know if there are different or not. All I know is the color is not the same. I see one is silver color front and one is gray color front. I want to know what's different between this two type of phone? Is that only the color different and everything is same inside? If anyone know can you please repply this message. Thank you!!!
Posted by
,
Tuesday, Oct. 16th, 2007
Hi there!
I’m interested in buying this HTC TYTN II windows mobile device with HSDPA.
I’ve two questions that I’d be grateful if you could answer for me:
Is my O2's USB dongle Mobile Broadband service compatible with this device? (I’ve phoned their support but they seem unsure not being familiar with the device.)
Secondly, if I can use this device on the O2 Mobile Broadband network could I then use the device as a modem for my laptop via Bluetooth? In that way I could have hsdpa access both on my phone and on my laptop.
Sincerest thanks in advance of your kind help!
First about the MicroSDHC cards, I just got one 6(six)Gb from www.buy.com and works like a charm!
David, I have a question how do you install the Tom Tom on the card not in the phone and how do you operate it, mine cannot connect although I downloaded the QuickGPS. Can you please enlight me:) Thank You SO SO MUCH! :) Vladimir - vladidadi@gmail.com
I Have a question reguard about the HTC TyTN II Kaiser, I want to know how many GB can this phone hold up to? Because someone told me that is only can hold up to 2gb, also someone told me it can hold up to 4gb. Also, I saw it online someone say this phone can hold up to 6gb. So I am very confuse. I really want to know what is the max gb can this phone hold up to? I did research online but didn't really have a result that I want it. If someone knows about it can you please reply me this message. Thank you!!!
Posted by
,
Thursday, Oct. 11th, 2007
TheOldMan - yes I'm using my Tilt with Adobe reader for ebooks. Works fine. Note this is not the Adobe LE software that comes standard on the device, but freeware reader offered by Adobe.
In addition to the Blackberry car charger Dave mentions, the generic "HTC 1" car charges work. I also accidentally found out the Samsung sync cables work too.
Hi guys,
Thanks for these reviews!
Just a simple question… nothing that has to do with “ram, rom, rem” nano-tube and micro semi conductors !
;-)
Has anyone tried to read a Pdf E-book using Htc Tytn II ?
Is the display clear and big enough to render small text font?
Thanx
Congratulations about the review! Well I am wondering abou buying the TyTN II or maybe the P3600i (both with GPS). I really don't know wich one is the best choose. The new P3600i comes with a 500 Mhz processor... any idea? I never had one PDA with keyboard.
Many tks
Luis Kantek
Oh Thank you so much!! Yes I found out about 3G SIM card thing today and my carrier (Rogers) carries that SIM card with 3G and I will purchase it as soon as I receive my phone. Thanx again!!
3G is wireless broadband provided to you by your wireless carrier. If your carrier has such a capability and it is available in your area, devices that have the appropriate capability will be able to use it.
As for Slingbox, no it does not come with the TyTn II. The Slingbox composes of two pieces: 1) the device that connects to your home cable box or other media component and then connects to your router. 2) The software that runs on your Windows Mobile device in order to stream the video out from the sling to your device.
As far as expenses go, you pay for the SlingBox itself and the software to run on your device. Once that is taken care of, the only other charges you incur when using sling is the cost of your wireless data plan. If you have unlimited data on your plan, then there is no issue since all you are doing is connecting via the net to your slingbox and sending and receiving data.
If you do not have 3g available in your area, I do not recommend a Sling. Sure, you can use WiFi if need be, but that is extremely limiting, requiring you to be close enough to a hot spot to use the sling. Using Sling on an EDGE connection can at times be very painful and slow to the point that video becomes unwatchable.
What is 3G anyway? Is it a US thing? I am in canada and I dont use At and T provider...I have a SIM card but what is 3G? Is it a special thing I should have to use my not-yet-recieved-TyTN II? Also I purchased 2GB Kingston MicroSD with two adapters, but I want to know if I bought the right memory card for TyTN 2.....please help me. Thank you
I am going to reveive my phone in 5 days and I just watched the video review on TyTN 2, and was wondering if SlingPlayer comes with the product and to view TV channels do I have to pay additional cost? I am not quite sure how that works if you watned to watch TV. I am most concerned with the charge I may get. I have to pay for TV channels in order for me to watch? Another question is that is there any schedule book (kinda like e-book) included in this phone? What are the features that I can use without getting charged by my provider? (my case Rogers in Canada). Please someone help me.
Does the TomTom GPS use the satellites directly or is it through AT&T by the minute? That is, do you pay a flat monthly fee for unlimited use (plus DVD purchase) or are there per minute charges?
Great review!
According to the specs on HTC's site, this device supports the SD 2.0 standard which is called SDHD (Secure Digital High Capacity) cards of 4 GB and up should work on it.
David, can you confirm there are no problems using the MicroSDHC type card. The specs only mention MicroSD support yet you said you are using the SanDisk 4GB MicroSDHC card. There are many warnings and forum posts mentioning that HC cards often do not work with some devices.
Thanks for the great review. I plan on buying one as soon as it is available here.
Posted by
,
Friday, Sep. 28th, 2007
Dave - What are your thoughts about the TyTN II compared to your iPhone? Which are you using more and why?
JohnCar, if you upgrade to any phone within at&t that involves 3G, then they will give you a 3G SIM card for free. This happened to me when I bought a SYNC when those phones first came out. I didnt have to pay for the SIM, but I did have to get a Media Bundle only because the phone supports Cingular Video. The only thing that I THINK will change (dont hold me to this because im not for sure) is you upgrading to the TyTN II, you MIGHT have to get a data plan, but I dont know if you have to, so I dont know if this will raise your messaging rates. Hope this is some help to you!
Dave....great review!!! I'm seriously considering purchasing...this device appears to rock!!!!
A few questions I'm hoping you device-o-files can help me out with. I currently own an HTC Blueangel/Siemens SX66 which I really like, but its getting kinda old, not to mention its size. I have service with AT&T/Cingular and it has an older non-3G sim card. I also have an unlimited media net service for $20 bucks a month which has worked fine on the edge network...altough it can be slow....can't wait to experience 3G....unfortunatly its not in my area but about 30 miles away. I have a feeling if I upgrade to the TYTN I'll have to get a 3G sim card in order to take advantage of the 3G speeds which I believe will more than double my monthly data plan rate....yes/no?...or can I simply use my old sim card and keep using the $20/month unlimited media net/EDGE service. If so...I'm not sure if I will be able to really take advantage of what the TYTN/TILT has to offer if only using EDGE speed...any comments?
Lastly...I'm curious about using skype on this phone....does this mean I can make calls using the 3G or EDGE netwrok and avoid racking up min on my voice plan?....I have a feeling this is to good to be true.
Thans for your assistance.
John
Posted by
,
Wednesday, Sep. 26th, 2007
Hey Dave, Is it cheaper to buy the TyTN 2 from overseas or in United States.
Posted by
,
Wednesday, Sep. 26th, 2007
Dave - nice review, thanks. It has been a few weeks now since you have switched over to the Kaiser - any additional thoughts? You loving it more than ever? Strongly considering this purchase and would appreciate your additional input.
He meant that it did not come pre-installed. It comes with HTC's proprietary Voice software which should be disabled and unistalled if possible prior to setting up the MS Voice Command on it.
Hello David
Thanks for the great review....I had one question though - reg. Voice Command. When you say "I need Microsoft Voice Command... CASE CLOSED! Poor decision HTC!!!!", do you mean this PDA cannot handle Voice Command's features or that this app. isn't included with the unit but if purchased separately, would run on it without any issues. My decision to buy hinges on this feature, so appreciate your clarification.
Nice phone.. i have a few questions though. I was wondering when is the TytnII going to be avaible for AT&T and also is it best to wait for it to come out or buy it now. Is the price going to be cheaper for AT&T.
Posted by
,
Sunday, Sep. 23rd, 2007
Your quite welcome MarioDH. I think you and anyone else who like the slide-out keyboard form factor will be extremely happy with the Tytn II. It currently is the most robust, fastest and most feature packed slide-out QWERTY device out there.
I've got AT&T now w/ a Treo 650 w/ the unlimited smartphone data plan. Can I use the same SIM in a TyTN II and get access to 3G network w/o changing plans and such?
Great review. Just wondering is there a way of setting the phone to automatically start the texting application when you slide out the keyboard from the main menu screen like the HTC Vox (HTC s710). Many thanks in advance.
Regarding the Tytn II vs E90, the biggest and most obvious difference is form factor. The Tytn II has a smaller size which makes for a much more pocket-able device than the E90 as well as an easier to use keyboard. The Tytn II also has the extra camera for video calls and regular use. Another thing I am noticing from comments around town, is that the GPS on Tytn II appears to be faster as well. There is also the TouchFlo features of finger scrolling/flicking and panning that in conjuction with the touch screen (not available on E90) make for quite the one-handed user friendly device.
The E90, however, has better camera with flash on back (3.2 MP) and bigger as well as better resolution screen inside. Although, as a result of this new resolution for Nokia, the apps that are available out there for that screen size are limited much in the way they were for the first gen. square screen WM devices.
According to another review that I came across, they specifically mentioned that the front camera and rear camera can be toggled via the controls in the camera application.
Also, files can be sent via bluetooth using the "Beam File..." menu option in File Explorer.
Ah, JN, I see now. There is a difference, but for most users, not enough to affect us. Considering you don't need a rep to add MediaNet to your PDA, it is an easy work around. I have been using MediaNet for about a year w/ my 6945 and use up to half a gig in data sometimes more a month (I thether a lot) and have had no issues. 20 is better than 40 with no differece to me for internet surfing and data usage, I will stick it to them and keep my 20/mo.
I'm undecided between the TyTN II and Nokia's E90. Assuming I'm OS neutral, can someone point me in the right direction?
By the way, can the frontal camera of the TyTN II be used for normal camera operations while the the unit is closed (keyboard not extended)? Is there a key to switch back and forth between the frontal and back cameras?
Also, can files be bluetoothed out from the device using Fle Explorer? I'm still using a Windows Mobile 2003 SE device (BenQ P50) which does not support this feature.
Been on the 19.99 media net plan for over 2 yrs(using a T750 & switching to an 8525) have had no problems. I use anywhere from 110-500mb of data per month, tethering to my laptop on ocassion.
Hmm, seemed to work for my sis and mother (family plan for them), and it works with her Treo she just purchased recently and me mums 6515, so... I don't know what the difference is really, except a whole lot of mullah.
From what I understand, if AT&T knows you have a data-capable phone other than a "smartphone" (ie. Blackjack), they require you to get the full PDAConnect plan. If you have a medianet plan prior to purchasing a "robust data device" then you would be able to carry that over to your new device.
at&t is usually pretty good at not crippling devices. I did note data plans tiered to include teathering, etc.. Doesn't seem too unreasonable considering speeds and not having to pay for a laptop card.
T-Mo's network is limited to EDGE anyway right now. Their supposed high-speed network is reportedly going to be on the 1700Mhz band they purchased that the TyTN II (or my TyTN for that matter) doesn't support. I will probably bite the bullet and go at&t when their version of this comes out soon.
To my knowledge there are no phones that support 1700Mhz anyway (right now) so it looks like T-Mo will have devices made and doubt MFG's will make unlocked phones compatible in the future just for this small market - But we could be supprised.
Dave, what of the finger scrolling/flicking and panning capabilities of the Tytn II? Is it so poor that it has not been worth mentioning thus far, or do you find it still necessary to use the stylus in your everyday usage?
I find that with my Wing I rarely have to use the stylus. I would assume that with the Tytn II's beveled egdes around the screen and the software it would be easy to achieve a totally free stylus experience for non-technical everyday usage, but would like to hear it from the horses mouth.
Alright, back on the subject at hand. Great review Dave. I have been wondering about the effects of running a full GPS program like TomTom and loading it down with other tasks. I love my TyTN w/ a cooked WM6 ROM without the bloatware and runs fast and stable.
Regarding battery life - let's face it, battery technology hasn't quite kept up with power demands especially on a device like this. If we're going to keep devices small and/or thin, we are going to have to give a little and just carry a second battery! The darned things are only the size of a matchbook (if you're young enough to remember what those are)!
I expect some battery technology breakthroughs soon, noting the MIT Nano-Capacitor and DeWalt's Nano-Lithium.
Until then, I will use my TyTN to listen to Dave's, Mickey's and other podcasts while working and running my company from these amazing devices - with 2 batteries if necessary.
I'll plan on a TyTN II
I think you misunderstood me, since I don't really know much about actual circuitry designs, I can't really argue with how much that affects the device although I know it does (I was agreeing there). My point was that to me, and correct me if I am wrong, there are far more factors than just the circuitry and battery capacity that affects the actual length of time before the battery is drained. Like, to me a larger screen is going to use more battery juice, less RAM means the device works harder (right?) so the battery drain is greater, less processor power again means the device is working harder, etc. I have also noticed the difference in antenna strength between phones, and with less signal strength, the battery dies faster as the phone is using more power to help the signal boost. All that kinda stuff and more I would think affects the length of time before ANY battery drains, regardles of capacity, right? So honestly I have to say really what all this boils down to for me, is I don't really care about what makes the battery last longer as long as the battery lasts long enough for me to get through my uses for it. I look at it from device to device, if one device lasts significantly longer than another, I don't know exactly why, I just know it lasts longer :), that is all I really need to know. I guess the origin of the argument is, if the battery life isn't "long enough" it is up to the manufacturer to do it's best to increase that time, whether it be better circuitry, or larger batter capacity, or whatever the major determining factors are. That's where I don't know enough to really go any further, since maybe the device couldn't support a larger battery, or similar things I just don't know. What good is any mobile device if it requires being attached to a charger the majority of the time is the underlying point. One thing I know we can all agree on is that the devices we use today will never have "enough" battery life!!
Con, I agree with you 100% on whether or not pre-release specs are completely precise. It seems there is a discrepancy with the site JN listed and HP's info. As for the Tytn II info, it appears to be on target.
Not sure about hostility stuff, but regarding the end user effect on battery drain and observable processing differences I agree as well. Naturally, if one only has one program running in the background all the time, there is more CPU utilization headroom for an observable difference just based on the amount of programs running. However, that is not what I was referring to.
I was referring to benchmarking tests which can show an observable or non-observable difference in processing power. This difference would then be observable or non-observable between two devices with the same software running and same hardware configuration, excluding processor of course.
Regarding the battery drain, I disagree with you on that as I mentioned before, the circuity is intimately involved in the outcome of the battery drain and cannot be ignored without sacrificing precision. My MDA has a battery with 1250 mAh capacity, and my Wing has a battery with 1130 mAh capacity. By yours and JN's logic my Wing should drain more with the same hardware configuration and installed apps. This is not the case, it winds up being that I can go just as long without having to recharge my Wing as I do with MDA. This is due to the change in circuitry efficiency. (I have observed this with other devices as well) So, I would disagree and submit that only in the case when the ciruitry is identical would there be an observable difference in battery drain time. When comparing different circuits (devices), generally speaking, you would have to empiricly determine what the difference in drain time is in order to have any kind of precision, as the mAh measure can tell you very little (especially when you are dealing with small differences in mAh)in this scenario.
Both of these facts are pretty important when considering a benefit in these areas since, and I believe we can all agree on this, if the benefit is not a real world benefit it is not worth all that much for most people.
In the words of Spinal Tap: "11 is 1 more than 10." ;P
I always try to get my facts straight before coming to any type of conclusion. And if there is one thing I have learned in the world of computer electronics, is that until it is actually released, I tend not to trust anything word for word. Circuitry does have a large impact, but larger battery capacity generally means longer battery life in my experience, but I couldn't tell you the engineering aspects behind the factors. Also, there are so many factors that affect battery life, hardware, software, user settings, celluar signal strength, etc. The same thing is going to be true with the processor, faster processor can mean faster performance (why else would we always be trying to get the latest/fastest one out there?) I love the TyTn II, but I need the stationary qwerty. But that is all just user needs at that point.
I was referring to AKU versions, and there are usually (not always) significant differences in AKU versions.
Regarding the camera specs, do you happen to have a link to that information from HP, Con?
"you gain in faster processor, bigger battery"
What evidence do you have to show that there is a user observable difference in performance between the two processors? In addition, what significance is the bigger battery? We all know that the time interval between needed recharging of the battery is a combination of the battery size in mah AND the efficiency of the circuitry. Without some kind of empiricle evidence, assuming that the a bigger battery will necessitate larger time intervals between needed recharging is pure conjecture.
As I stated before, I think that the HP device will make those who like the face keyboard form factor happy as this device will no doubt attain a similar reliability factor to the Tytn II.
For me the slider keyboard is more effective and ergonomic for big messages, editting documents, or a long duration of uninterrupted messaging e.g. IMng. I also value the increased screen real estate. That's just my opinion.
I wouldn't take any stock in things like OS kernel version. The HP has not been released yet and any information displayed on the pdanet page, especially regarding software is subject to change.
As for bloatware, what people are forgetting is that many times it can be disabled. If the bloatware are stand alone applications, then there is no issue. For example, I considered HTC's voice dial software "bloatware", so I disabled it and installed VC in place of it. The bloatware on the att WM6 Treo are standalone application which only take storage memory, so not an issue.
Plus, bloatware is not the primary (or only) reason for why one device has more usuable RAM than another. Each OEM uses different system resources and drivers which are customized to the specific device they run on. It is the optimization of these various parts of the system that contribute (NOT the ONLY reason) to the amount of available free RAM a system has.
With regards to the HP, it's the only qwerybar that matches the functionality of the TyTn. What you lose in screen size, front camera, autofocus, you gain in faster processor, bigger battery, lighter device, slimmer form-factor, and always available keyboard.
Any unlocked HP device I have had really hasn't been "bloated" and I don't know how accurate that comparison is. According to HP, the 900c is auto-focus. With the GPS, the is no listed difference I can see in the GPS aspect of that chipset, just different aspects of the entire chipset. Smaller screen size, but that's what you pay with a qwerty-bar PDA. What is the difference in the OS? Newer MS OS, as Windows in the past has proven, aren't always better. I would say other than minor differences in software/hardware and the obvious in form-factor, these two are pretty much the same to me.
Same amount of physical RAM, but Wing has less available RAM for user programs, (less headroom 15 as opposed to 23) thought I made that clear the first time.
HP looks interesting, but no finger scrolling/panning capability, older OS, older GPS chipset, no A/F on camera, less screen real estate, no secondary camera (not a deal breaker for me) and a non-rotary jog dial (also not much of a deal breaker for me.) I can see how folks who like the keyboard on the might be happy w/ HP device though. Judging from amount of memory, provided not too much bloatware, the device should prove to be just as stable as Tytn.
Sorry to hear that your Wing is less stable than your MDA, which btw have the same amount of RAM. The WM6 Treo is rock solid, more solid than any device I have owned over the 7 years of using PPC's.
"...but odds of bad sectors, checksum errors, etc, are just as great on a device with a larger span of memory."
Actually, when it comes to creating the extra head room, it works out like the following eg.:
If you have a 64 MB chip with about 2 MB of unstable physical memory then you can only have about 62 MB of memory which can be used before you start running into issues which the software must attempt to compensate for. If you take the same memory and double it, you now have the headroom of 124 MB before you start running into trouble.
From what I have seen almost all of these mobile devices allow only a fraction of the total RAM to be free for running user programs. On the MDA it would soft reset to about 23 MB, although ~64 MB was the total allocated program memory. On the Wing (WM6 device) it is reduced to only about 15 MB on soft reset. The Wing is more unstable than my MDA. Take now Dave's Treo, compared to the 100+ MB that are free on startup from the Tytn II. Same results Tytn waaaay more stable than his Treo. Simple, more headroom, there are other variables affecting the stability for sure, but they too are mostly related to the headroom on these devices.
If a given amount of memory has a given amount of units of that memory that are unstable or simply unusable (physical reality, just like reality that ALL HDDs have a given amount of bad sectors), then you have a scenario where the head room, or "ceiling" for data, is now a variable in the function of the device stability."
Well, as a software developer, I am always thinking software. Overall, you may be correct in your statement about large memory devices, but odds of bad sectors, checksum errors, etc, are just as great on a device with a larger span of memory.
Well, I can say with 100% certainty, none of the ATT bloatware has anything to do with system processes that are loaded via startup items or services. As a matter of fact, most of it are just links to online applications, pages. Other than that most of the "bloatware" Dave is referring to are standalone applications. Since we were speaking with regards to the Treo 750, my statement is correct. I can't vouch for the junk T-mo loads on their devices.
You are correct on that one Jerry, the Tytn II is not available for sale in U.S. other than via importers. AT&T should have their version of it called the "Tilt", I believe, sometime soon.
It will be interesting to see how they cripple the device.
"The only thing available RAM helps is the ability to load more applications into RAM at one time. If I load 5 applications and still have 15mb of free ram on my Treo, memory is not an issue. With additional RAM, the TyTn II may be able to open double the amount of applications at once."
Jerry regarding the RAM memory's impact on stability, I disagree. Considering the physical limitations on the ability of these cheap memory chips, commonly used in mobile devices, you will notice a startling correlation. If a given amount of memory has a given amount of units of that memory that are unstable or simply unusable (physical reality, just like reality that ALL HDDs have a given amount of bad sectors), then you have a scenario where the head room, or "ceiling" for data, is now a variable in the function of the device stability. Ergo, by having more RAM memory, or a higher "ceiling" the less likely you are to experience issues with the stability of your device. Your assumption of how memory works in a system does not take into account these physical realities for which software cannot 100% compensate for.
"That only affects storage memory, not RAM. None of the bloatware is loaded on a soft reset."
Disagree here to, simply put, if the bloatware is running in the background, as the bloatware from T-Mobile does, it takes up RAM. When the programs are running they use up RAM, it does not matter where they are stored.
Does anybody have any idea where I can pick this unit up in the US? Next week I will be in the US and would love to get it somewhere but don't have the time to order it online. Any suggestions where I could get one? I will be in Denver and Seattle.
"You cant even compare the Treo 750 and the TyTN II since memory on the TyTN II is more than double the Treo. "
I believe that statement to be a bit misleading. The only thing available RAM helps is the ability to load more applications into RAM at one time. If I load 5 applications and still have 15mb of free ram on my Treo, memory is not an issue. With additional RAM, the TyTn II may be able to open double the amount of applications at once.
"The WM6 Treo ROM has so much bloatware it becomes a problem for memory."
That only affects storage memory, not RAM. None of the bloatware is loaded on a soft reset.
However, that being said, storage memory helps with being able to save more data on the device.
Jerry the only problem I had installing the Treo ROM was that my card wasnt formatted properly. Other than that it went off without a hitch..
You cant even compare the Treo 750 and the TyTN II since memory on the TyTN II is more than double the Treo. Also the TyTN II has the embedded GPS and Wifi.
The WM6 Treo ROM has so much bloatware it becomes a problem for memory. I know I can hack the registry but the TyTN has no bloatware at all...
My point exactly the Tytn had same processing power but less memory, as well as a slew of other 400 mhz devices prior to this one.
I have WM6 on my Wing and it is much more unstable than my MDA with the same processor and memory. So, the WM6 definitely is not the default fixer for resetting issues.
Dave, do you find this device to be more stable than your Treo and does Treo have WM6? Also, why no mention of finger scrolling/flicking and panning capabilities?
I doubt it's either. It's mostly WM6. My WM6 Treo is the most stable and quick device I have ever owned. A completly different device with WM6 over WM5. As for memory, my device rarely, if ever drops below 12mb free which doesn't scream to me that lack of memory is an issue.
Sure, a nice 400mhz processor and gobs of ram doesn't hurt, but I am sure that the same device with WM5 wouldn't seem as slick. Oh, wait...that's the original TyTn.
Steve, I think that processing power had little to do with it as 400 Mhz devices have been around for some time now. However, this is the first device with sooooo much memory, in comparison to the others.
I believe the extra program memory is the reason for the increase in performance and stability.
Great review. Have you done one for the HTC Touch?
Posted by
TxGadgetDude,
Wednesday, Sep. 12th, 2007
Dave,
My Wing has the same new jack for headphones/power. I notice that my MDA power cable works, but only if you put it in upside down compared to previous device. Same applies to car adapter.
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